Season 6, Episode 4: Grief and Loss with Liam Spicer
Monique interviews Liam Spicer about grief and loss. You’ll notice that Liam is not a neurodivergent woman, but we’ve decided to make an exception this time because Liam is an expert in neurodivergence and grief.
Liam is a Senior Lecturer in Psychology, a Psychologist, an EMDR Consultant, and an Accredited Schema Therapist based in Launceston, Tasmania.
He is also an Autistic ADHDer and is passionate about training, research, and collaboration with other neurodivergent individuals in the Neurodiversity Affirming Space. Liam’s current PhD is focused on the use of Schema Therapy for Prolonged Grief, and he has published journal articles and book chapters on grief in addition to presenting at national and international conferences. His interest in this area derives from his professional and personal lived experience of loss.
🎧 NOTE: This episode contains mention of death and loss, so some listeners may decide to skip it.
In this episode, Monique and Liam cover:
Liam’s journey to understanding his own neurodivergence.
What is grief?
Is there such a thing as a ‘normal’ response to grief, and what are some common myths about grief?
Different types of grief and loss (and the validity of feeling big feelings about all of these types of losses!), including death loss, loss of aspects of daily living, loss associated with life transitions and with chronic or acute health conditions, loss of routines or coping mechanisms, and grief associated with diagnosis of neurodivergence.
Some key factors for neurodivergent people and their supports to keep in mind when dealing with grief and loss, and strategies around managing these ND specific factors.
What is ‘Prolonged Grief’, and what can you expect when seeing a therapist for Prolonged Grief?
Liam’s personal experiences with grief and strategies for supporting grieving loved ones. Note: this section discusses miscarriage loss, so consume with care if this is a tough subject for you.
[00:01:11] Liam’s journey to understanding his own neurodivergence
Key Takeaways:
In response to the question we ask all guests, “What does neurodivergence mean to you?” Liam remarks that listening to the guest responses over the years is, in and of itself, a beautiful display of neurodiversity.
Liam explains that for him, neurodivergence means “walking a different path,” which reflects the Latin root of the word “diverge.” He sees this as an eloquent way to describe being different and embracing that difference.
At a personal level, Liam identifies two key words that stand out for him regarding neurodivergence, with the first being ‘change.’
Change encompasses the ongoing process of understanding one’s own neurodivergence, involving self-discovery, recognising, and celebrating differences.
Liam highlights that at a wider societal level, neurodivergence brings about change by encouraging people to understand different ways of doing things, being, and functioning. He sees this societal change as a positive and healthy outcome, both directly and indirectly, from increased awareness and acceptance of neurodivergence.
Liam shares a personal anecdote about visiting a bookstore and buying a book for his daughter, which led to a moment of reflection on neurodivergence.
He describes finding a passage in a Nancy Tillman book that beautifully and eloquently captures what neurodivergence means to him, making it a poignant illustration for the topic.
“You’re an original, be yourself,” highlights the ongoing journey of self-discovery and understanding.
Liam liked the cheeky element of the second part: “Sometimes a someone will give you the feeling that their bells and whistles are much more appealing. ‘Look this way, talk this way, be just like me,’ that’s monkey business. Don’t eat from that tree.”
Liam thought this was a good illustration of the importance of embracing differences, a key component of what neurodivergence means to him.
The second word that comes to mind for Liam is ‘connection.’
He sees this on two levels:
Connection to self, where understanding builds self-compassion, and
connection to community, where being embraced, welcomed, and celebrated within the neurodivergent community has had profound benefits.
This has allowed him to accept and celebrate aspects of himself as he gains greater self-understanding.
Liam reflects on his early experiences with neurodivergence, noting that he was identified as gifted at around five or six.
His school had reported “very high activity levels, quite restless and seeming like I needed lots of stimulation,” which led to an assessment by a paediatrician.
The outcome was a recognition of his intelligence, with the suggestion that Liam be given more challenging work and stimulation at school.
Back then, there was a lack of understanding around ADHD and Autism, especially in children who were also identified as gifted. Despite some signs, his ADHD and Autism were not recognised at the time.
Teachers suggested giving him harder work due to his intelligence, and although some teachers raised queries about ADHD, it was not formally identified during his primary school years.
It wasn’t until the last few years that Liam was formally identified as Autistic and ADHD.
Liam always felt different, noting how it’s quite interesting to look back at things with a different lens through the process of self-understanding.
Looking at old school reports now, he recognises comments like “has so much potential but doesn’t pay attention” make more sense through the lens of neurodivergence.
Liam reiterates that while his formal identification of Autism and ADHD came in the last few years, he had always felt different from others.
The process of understanding his neurodivergence has been validating and insightful, though he acknowledges that gaining this understanding later in life has also brought challenges.
Monique highlights the underdiagnosis of girls and women with Autism and ADHD, along with the ongoing effort to close the gender gap in diagnosis and support.
She notes that many AMAB individuals, including cismen, often also go undiagnosed in childhood and are only identified later in life.
Some men may internalise their neurodivergence or mask their symptoms, while others with inattentive presentations—like Monique’s brother, who was diagnosed in his late twenties—are often overlooked because they don't fit the ‘typical’ hyperactive male profile.
Monique touches on the concept of being twice-exceptional, which has been discussed before on the podcast.
She explains that when someone is intellectually gifted and falls into that twice-exceptional category, either their giftedness or their neurodivergence—such as Autism, ADHD, or dyslexia—can be missed, leading to a lack of support.
She acknowledges that while intellectual giftedness may help compensate for certain challenges, like social difficulties and fitting into a neurotypical world, it doesn't eliminate those struggles entirely.
See ‘What does an Autistic, ADHD’er brain look like?’ for more.
Liam reflects on his primary school experience, noting his passion for learning and constant need for stimulation.
He acknowledges that being so focused on schoolwork may have contributed to teachers or others not noticing other challenges he was facing.
Looking back now, with a better understanding of himself, he recognises some of the traits that were present during those early years but weren't identified at the time.
Liam recalls a particular primary school assignment on the wonders of the world, where he became obsessively focused on editing and perfecting the project.
He reflects on spending around 50 hours on the task, questioning whether it was “normal” to dedicate so much time to a primary school assignment, which, in hindsight, was a clear sign of his hyperfocus traits.
Liam reflects on his childhood, remembering how he was described as an “incredibly sensitive little soul” despite doing well at school.
Though his sensitivity was never formally identified, he recalls crying daily and not knowing why.
Even when speaking to his parents during his adult diagnostic process, they were unsure of the reasons behind his sensitivity.
Liam now realises he was likely overwhelmed by school, masking and sensory overload. He often came home from school and isolating in his room for some downtime.
Monique acknowledges that in cases of late diagnosis, it’s often members of the neurodivergent community who may first recognise and flag potential neurodivergence.
However, people often have concern around suggesting someone might be Autistic or ADHD, questioning whether it will be received as helpful or offensive due to the stigma surrounding it.
[00:14:59] What is grief, and what is normal to experience when grieving?
Key Takeaways:
Grief is our response to loss.
Liam explains that grief is a universal experience and that it can encompass a wide range of emotions, including sadness, anger, guilt, and shock.
Depending on the circumstances, such as when someone has had a terminal illness, grief can also include emotions like relief, knowing that the person is no longer suffering.
Grief is not just emotional; it also involves behaviours like social withdrawal or reduced activity as we go through the process of understanding and making sense of the loss.
A common myth about grief is that it goes away over time, but from theoretical approaches and experiences, we know this to be true: Grief doesn't disappear.
Instead of going away, grief is something we accommodate and adjust to as we move forward.
A helpful way to think about this is that life grows around the grief rather than the grief itself becoming smaller.
It's important to understand this perspective when considering what a “normal” grief response looks like.
Another myth related to grief is that there’s often an expectation that we’ll eventually feel the same as we did before the loss. The reality is that grief profoundly changes us in many ways throughout our lives.
There’s also a common myth that everyone adjusts to and responds to grief in the same way, but the truth is that each person’s response is highly individual.
For neurodivergent individuals, additional components must be considered in how they adjust to and cope with grief, making it crucial to break the myth that grief is experienced uniformly.
Neuro-normative expectations can place further stress and burden on the grieving person, particularly for those who experience and process grief differently.
Grief can be just as profound for non-family losses, such as the loss of an animal or non-death losses.
The experience of grief and how we adjust to it is not dependent on the type of loss or our relationship with the person or thing we've lost.
There are many different factors can influence the intensity and severity of grief.
The assumption that a family member's loss will always be more significant is a misconception, and every individual's grief process is unique regardless of the type of loss.
Monique agrees that many factors influence how we experience grief, including the level of social support, sense of identity, spiritual or religious beliefs, and other sources of meaning or purpose in life.
There is no single “right” way to experience grief, as everyone's process is unique and can vary in intensity and duration.
Grief often leads to a change in one's identity, especially when the loss is tied to a hope, dream, or future goal.
People may question the timing of grief, wondering why someone hasn’t “moved on” after six months, a year, or even longer, or why they seem to have moved on “too quickly,” highlighting unrealistic expectations around how long grief “should” last.
“The experience of grief (how we adjust and how we respond) is not dependent on the type of loss. It’s also not dependent on the person and our relationship with them.
Sometimes, people think that just because it’s a family member, it’s going to be experienced as a more significant loss than perhaps another form of grief, like loss of an animal or a form of non-death.
There can be a whole range of different factors that impact the grief, as well as the intensity, severity, and feelings around that particular loss, which is an important consideration.”
Liam points out that a common myth, which needs to be dispelled, is that grief is the same as depression.
Historically, grief was often misunderstood, with low mood and disengagement from activities seen as signs of depression, but this is not always the case.
It’s crucial to normalise feelings of sadness, low mood, or withdrawal during grief, recognising these as valid and normal human responses to loss rather than immediately pathologising them as depression.
Grief and its associated emotions are different from depression, even though they can co-occur in some individuals. Recognising this distinction is important for a more accurate understanding of the grieving process.
Grief is an individual experience, and the idea that it progresses in a set sequence, like the widely known five stages, is outdated.
The five-stage model—featuring stages like denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance—may describe aspects of some people’s grief, but not everyone experiences these phases, and they don’t always occur in a specific order.
It’s important to understand that everyone’s grief process is unique, and it’s okay if someone doesn’t fit into the traditional categories outlined by older models of grief.
“Grief occurs in different ways for everyone, and it often comes and goes based on what’s going on in your life. So, for example, we might lose a particular person in our life, and we might have that immediate period of grief for two to four weeks afterwards, for example, where we feel quite sad, and we’re making sense and processing those feelings. And then, two months later, we could be driving down the street, and we hear a song that reminds us of that person, and the grief comes up again. ”
Liam reminds us that there shouldn’t be timeframes or expectations placed on how long someone takes to process grief. Everyone’s experience is unique, and it’s essential to respect and honour their personal journey.
Grief isn’t something that simply goes away. Whether someone takes a long time or processes their grief quickly, it’s important not to judge but to support their individual way of coping.
Monique points out that pre-grieving can occur when someone anticipates a loss, such as ending a relationship or knowing a loved one or pet has a terminal illness. This process allows them to begin grieving before the loss actually happens.
When the loss finally occurs, those who have pre-grieved might be seen as moving on quickly, but it’s because they’ve already processed some of their emotions beforehand.
It's important not to make assumptions about someone's grief based on outward behaviour, as they might still be processing emotions privately, especially during alone time or at night when distractions are fewer.
For many Autistic people, sticking to a routine or going to work can actually help them cope with grief, even if there's a societal expectation to take time off.
Coping strategies vary, and outward appearances don’t always reflect the internal grief process.
Liam reflects on the loss of his 18-year-old cat, explaining how pre-grieving helped him process the emotions beforehand, making the actual loss a bit easier to handle.
He highlights that for many Autistic individuals, finding comfort in certainty, planning, and control can aid in navigating the grief process.
Pre-grieving, as he mentions, is not only helpful for himself but something he's observed in his clients as well.
[00:26:44] Different types of grief and loss
Key Takeaways:
Liam notes that grief is often associated with death, but there are many forms of non-death loss that are equally valid and impactful.
Non-death losses can include daily life losses, such as changes in work roles, family structures, retirement, or transitions like moving from primary to high school.
Major life transitions and milestones can trigger feelings of grief, highlighting the importance of recognising and validating these types of losses.
Monique raises the point that life transitions, such as starting daycare or school, can be overwhelming for neurodivergent children, often leading to separation anxiety or distress due to routine changes.
The transition from high school to “what's next” can be particularly difficult, as the routine that students have known for 13 years suddenly disappears, leaving a sense of emptiness.
Grief can arise for neurodivergent individuals as they watch peers move on to new milestones, while they themselves need time to recover from burnout, leading to feelings of struggle and comparison.
Life transitions can encapsulate multiple layers of grief, from the loss of structure and routine to the absence of familiar faces like a favourite teacher or colleagues.
During such transitions, individuals may experience various forms of grief, making these periods complex and emotionally challenging.
Monique shares that for Autistic individuals, the longer they stay in a routine or environment, the harder it can be to adjust when that routine changes or ends.
Significant struggles often arise when long-standing routines are disrupted, making it crucial to acknowledge the emotional impact of such changes.
On the flip side, for ADHDers, grief can stem from struggles with completing tasks, such as finishing a degree or advancing in a career. Challenges in staying on a particular path and achieving promotions can lead to feelings of frustration and loss.
Liam adds that even when a decision is made by choice, such as leaving a job or stopping a degree, feelings of grief and loss can still arise.
The act of choosing change doesn’t negate the emotional impact or sense of loss tied to those decisions.
Monique highlights how Autistic individuals often become deeply attached to objects, routines, and familiar places, such as their home, local cafes, or community spots.
So, even seemingly small changes, like a favourite cafe closing, can have a significant emotional impact, which might seem trivial to others but is deeply felt by many Autistic people.
The idea of moving or decluttering, such as minimalism, can feel overwhelming and unappealing, reinforcing the strong connection to possessions and familiar spaces.
Monique shares that she can't imagine moving from Brisbane, noting how these attachments and routines are often not fully acknowledged in discussions about neurodivergence.
She wonders if the rituals and routines Autistic people develop are ways to manage or avoid the intense emotions of grief.
As an example, she mentions her older dog, explaining that she’s been pre-grieving his eventual loss since he was like five, a way of preparing herself emotionally for what’s to come. Sometimes, it’s lead to intense nostalgia, even when the situation is not yet immediate.
As a strategy to cope with the impending grief of losing her older dog, she decided to get a puppy, offering her something else to focus on when the time comes.
She acknowledges that this is a personal way to manage the grief of major pet loss, which has truly been helpful for her.
All in all, life transitions can be significant for Autistic, AuDHD, and ADHD individuals.
In adult life, gaining something often comes with a loss.
For example, becoming a parent fulfills a dream, but it also means losing aspects of your pre-parenting life, which will never be the same.
Many parents may grieve their pre-parenting life even while deeply loving their children and being content with their choices.
Major transitions like having children, fertility challenges, miscarriages, or not being able to have as many children as hoped are additional sources of grief.
There are many factors contributing to grief, such as not being able to have the birth experience you had planned.
Women, in particular, may experience grief associated with perimenopause, menopause, or needing to undergo a hysterectomy.
While these transitions may be positive for some, they can also bring a sense of loss as the body, hormones, cognition, and abilities change.
Aging itself is a major life transition that can lead to feelings of grief as one adjusts to these changes.
Liam reminds us that it's essential to normalise and validate all forms of grief and loss, no matter how varied or seemingly trivial they may appear.
People may feel immense grief and think it's not valid, but it's crucial to understand that all these feelings are entirely valid.
Grief can manifest in many ways, and acknowledging the legitimacy of these emotions is important for healing.
“A trivial example of loss for me recently was a show I had been binge-watching for the last two months. When it ended, it had been such a consistent part of my routine, and watching it at certain points really helped during challenges in my life.
Even those little forms of loss can make you think, ‘Oh, this was such a big part of my life, even for just two months.’ It’s important to recognise that loss can happen in many ways through everyday experiences, as well as the major life events.”
[00:40:33] The grief within post-diagnosis of neurodivergence
Key Takeaways:
Liam acknowledges that post-diagnosis for neurodivergence, particularly when diagnosed later in life, can bring a significant sense of grief.
While there’s often a deep sense of self-understanding and self-compassion that comes with the diagnosis, the grief experienced can be just as profound as the benefits.
Grief can resurface at different points in life post-diagnosis, even after initial feelings of clarity.
While every individual's journey is unique, there is often a lingering sense of “What if?”—the feeling that life might have been easier had that understanding come during formative years, which is something Liam experienced first-hand.
This experience of grief post-diagnosis is common, especially as one reflects on the missed opportunities for self-compassion and support.
This grief may also resurface when individuals reflect on challenges tied to navigating a neurotypical world or when they face specific obstacles related to being neurodivergent.
For example, feelings of loss may arise when someone has to cut back on work due to burnout or other neurodivergent-related changes.
Monique shares that it’s essential to give yourself space after a diagnosis, as it might take six to twelve months to process, with initial feelings of grief, anger, and sadness over not receiving the support you needed.
Again, grief can resurface years later as you settle into your neurodivergent identity and make life adjustments, seeking accommodations or restructuring your life to better suit your needs.
The later the diagnosis, the more life experiences there may be to process, which can contribute to an ongoing sense of grief.
Using the example of her mum’s ADHD diagnosis at 65, Monique highlights how the number of years before diagnosis can affect the amount of processing needed, with her mum having 65 years to reflect on compared to Monique’s 32.
There can be feelings of processing lost opportunities and regrets, making it crucial to allow yourself the space and compassion to work through those emotions.
It’s important to validate the experience of grief or loss as it arises during different stages of post-identification.
“The later diagnosed you are, the more life experiences you do have to process. So, for example, my mum got diagnosed with ADHD when she was, I believe, 65. So, she has 65 years of stuff to process leading up to her diagnosis. Whereas I had 32 years of stuff to process—things like processing lost opportunities and regrets and things like that.
So yeah, definitely an important place to give yourself space and compassion to process those feelings.”
[00:45:37] Supports and strategies for neurodivergent people going through a grieving process
Key Takeaways:
Validating and normalising the experience of grief is essential for neurodivergent people as it removes barriers to processing and accommodating loss.
Recognising that all forms of grief and loss are valid is critical, as second-guessing or questioning the emotions can hinder adjustment.
It’s also important to consider how being neurodivergent may impact one's experience of grief, with various components and considerations involved.
Grief often impacts executive functioning, making it harder to manage tasks while processing emotions.
There are often additional executive functioning demands that arise with loss, whether it's death loss or non-death loss.
For instance, with death loss, there may be planning a funeral or organising appointments, tasks that may have been previously managed by the deceased.
Losing someone who handled certain responsibilities, like paying bills or organising family schedules, adds both emotional weight and practical challenges.
It's important to recognise how grief impacts executive functioning and consider ways to manage those demands.
One strategy is to identify key people in your life who might be able to assist with some of those executive functioning tasks during the grieving process.
Additionally, finding areas in your life where you can minimise demands can help ease the burden while coping with the emotional weight of loss.
Alexithymia, common in Autistic and ADHD people, can make it difficult to recognise and communicate emotions during grief, leading to a delayed emotional response or challenges in expressing needs for support.
Social expectations around grief, such as the assumption that everyone should come together to grieve, can be especially hard for neurodivergent individuals who might prefer solitude during emotional processing.
For some, being around family or others during grief can feel like an additional demand when they're already emotionally depleted, highlighting that people grieve in different ways.
The assumption that grieving together is better doesn’t apply to everyone, especially neurodivergent individuals who may need space to process things independently.
Research shows that support during grief can promote proactive coping and adjustment, but it's essential that the grieving process is led by the individual.
It's important to honour and respect how each person wants to engage in making sense of their loss, as everyone’s approach to grieving is unique.
Neuro-normative expectations often dictate how someone “should” grieve, but grieving is highly individual.
Some people may prefer to spend time in isolation after a loss rather than being surrounded by family members, which is a valid and personal way of processing grief.
Engaging in special interests or stimming can be inherently regulating for Autistic individuals during grief, helping them cope with the emotional demands.
Neuro-normative expectations around grieving can inhibit an individual's ability to process loss in a way that makes sense to them.
These expectations may add unnecessary stress, complicating the grieving process if the person feels pressured to conform to a standard that doesn't align with their needs.
Accepting that everyone grieves differently is crucial, and it’s important to ask rather than make assumptions about what someone needs during their grieving process.
Sometimes, individuals may not know what they need until they’ve gone through the experience, allowing them to reflect on what worked or didn’t for future situations.
Monique shares her personal experience with death loss, explaining how taking time away from work and sitting at home helped her process the grief.
She highlights how processing everything at once can feel overwhelming, so for some, distractions like cleaning or even online browsing can be soothing.
Monique found comfort in spending hours browsing jewelry online after a family member passed, noting that it helped her process grief without feeling overwhelmed.
Monique suggests that soothing activities like going into nature, walking, or spending time with low-demand people can help during grief.
She mentions that when verbal communication feels too demanding, gaming, parallel activities with others, or spending time with pets, who aren’t very demanding, can provide comfort.
Different people may need varying levels of stimulation when grieving. Some might want to go out and be around people for distraction, while others prefer solitude.
Emotional regulation, particularly for those with Autism and ADHD, can become even more difficult during grief, which is why seeking support from a doctor or therapist can be helpful.
Basic needs like sleep, eating, and hydration can be hard to maintain during grief, so having reminders or support from others to meet those needs is crucial.
Engaging in creative outlets, interests, or simply doing nothing and processing at your own pace are all valid strategies for coping with grief.
Going through grief often places individuals in overwhelming sensory environments or situations with high social demands, such as funerals or events related to the loss.
Non-death loss also brings significant life changes that can be inherently challenging, adding to the emotional burden.
It's crucial to take care of basic needs during this time, particularly paying attention to one's sensory needs to manage the added overwhelm.
[00:56:48] What is ‘Prolonged Grief’, and what can you expect when seeing a therapist for Prolonged Grief?
Key takeaways:
Liam shares that around 7 to 10 percent of the grieving population develop what is now commonly referred to as prolonged grief, though it has been called complicated grief in the past.
Prolonged grief is distinct due to the intensity and severity of the grief response, where the individual struggles to adjust or accommodate the loss into their life.
Unlike the typical grief process, where life grows around the grief, prolonged grief reflects an inability to integrate the loss, making it more challenging to cope over time.
Prolonged grief can occur when the natural healing process becomes blocked or stuck, preventing individuals from fully processing the loss.
Individuals may experience a significant yearning for the deceased and intense emotional pain, with a sense of emptiness that dominates their thoughts.
This type of grief often impacts daily functioning, accompanied by a profound sense of meaninglessness, where life feels devoid of purpose or direction after the loss.
Research shows that while there’s no rigid timeframe for prolonged grief, it typically involves intense symptoms persisting for at least 12 months post-loss.
Cultural factors and individual circumstances should be considered, but prolonged grief occurs when the grieving process significantly impacts functioning and consumes the person's mental space.
Prolonged grief is distinct from typical grief responses due to its severity and the way it dominates the individual’s existence.
Seeking support from a therapist for general grief is an individual decision, and it’s important not to pathologise normal grief responses.
In cases of prolonged grief, a therapist would typically begin with an assessment, gathering information about the loss and the individual’s life history.
Research indicates that certain factors may make someone more likely to develop prolonged grief, which could be explored during the assessment process.
Previous experiences of trauma and certain coping patterns can contribute to developing prolonged grief.
People who tend to put their needs aside are more likely to experience prolonged grief.
An enmeshed relationship with the person lost is another factor that can lead to a prolonged grief response.
Therapy typically starts with understanding your history, life experiences, and factors that might have contributed to developing prolonged grief.
The therapist provides education on prolonged grief, helping you make sense of it in the context of your individual circumstances.
After this, the focus shifts to identifying and addressing the factors that have caused the grief process to become blocked or stuck.
Therapy may involve exploring feelings like guilt, self-blame, or regret that could be preventing you from processing the loss.
The therapist helps you adjust to life after the loss, supporting you in finding meaning again and navigating how your life has changed.
There are various treatment approaches and strategies available, and these are typically tailored to address the specific factors affecting your grieving process.
Therapy for grief isn't as commonly discussed as therapy for other issues like depression, anxiety, or trauma, so it's helpful for people to understand what that process might look like.
It's important to normalise seeking support for grief and provide clarity on what to expect in therapy for those experiencing loss.
People may have reservations about the term “prolonged grief,” questioning whether grief should be pathologised, especially given how individual grief responses are.
Research has shown that when individuals understand their grief as being more complicated or “stuck,” they often feel relief and become more open to seeking treatment.
While it’s essential not to overpathologise normal grief, it's equally important to provide support to those experiencing more complicated forms of grief.
[01:04:35] Liam’s personal experiences with grief and strategies for supporting grieving loved ones.
Key takeaways:
Liam reflects on how his understanding of neurodivergence has shed light on different losses he’s experienced, particularly with early losses, like the passing of grandparents.
One significant loss at 18 highlighted his preference to be with a specific friend, rather than family, as a way to cope, which, at the time, he questioned as being “normal.”
With his current understanding of neurodivergence, he now recognises that this personal space and connection with a specific person was essential for processing his grief.
As a young adult, Liam’s wife lost her father, and though he had no personal connection with him, this experience of grief provided him with key insights into the complexity of loss.
This situation deepened his understanding of grief, despite not knowing the person directly, highlighting the nuanced and varied ways in which loss can impact us.
Ways that Liam supported his wife going through a significant loss
Key aspects of supporting his wife through grief involved giving her space to process and offering a consistent reminder that he was available to talk when she needed.
Liam emphasises the importance of holding space for the grieving person, validating their experience, and being mindful of emotionally significant dates, such as anniversaries or birthdays.
On those significant days, he suggests shared activities, like going to the beach, where his wife could reflect on memories of her father.
He stresses the need to avoid placing expectations on how someone should grieve or how long their grieving process will last.
Offering support should focus on checking in with what the person needs and ensuring they feel supported without pressure or assumptions.
Monique highlights that in times of grief, people may provide different types of support.
One person might offer practical help, like making meals or caring for children, while another might offer emotional support.
She also notes that some people may simply provide consistency by being there for the grieving person.
In cases where there’s a community or support network, these roles might be divided among several people, each contributing in their own way.
Sometimes, these roles overlap, and one person may offer a combination of practical, emotional, and consistent support.
Liam introduces the acronym DLR used in the grief field, which stands for ‘doer, listener, and respite figure.’
A doer refers to someone who takes on practical tasks or handling executive demands, like planning meals, cleaning the house, doing laundry, dropping off meals, and other practical responsibilities during difficult times.
A listener offers emotional support, simply being present without needing to respond.
The respite figure is someone with whom the grieving person can engage in everyday activities, like catching up for coffee or doing something unrelated to the grief.
Liam highlights that it's helpful to keep the DLR framework in mind when providing support, noting that not all support needs to be emotional or therapy-like. Engaging in shared interests or activities can also be a valuable form of support.
Liam’s shares how one of the pivotal experiences that led to his PhD research on prolonged grief was the journey he and his wife faced while trying to start a family
They experienced the devastating loss of a miscarriage at 13 weeks, a profoundly challenging time filled with shock, sadness, and despair.
The loss wasn't a singular experience for Liam and his wife, as they went through two more miscarriages after the first. This added immense difficulty to an already challenging process.
Reflecting on his neurodivergence, Liam acknowledges that the grief from these losses sparked a deep desire to understand more about grief, which became a special interest during that time.
Due to the uncertainty surrounding the losses, Liam recognises that his interest in grief and making sense of it all evolved into a hyperfixation, driven by his neurodivergent traits.
Liam reflects on how his neurodivergent traits led him to obsessively research miscarriage, driven by a need for certainty and to ensure they were doing everything possible.
He spent countless hours researching the causes of recurrent miscarriage, gathering a significant amount of information on the topic.
This research eventually led them to a specialist in Sydney, a world-leading expert in recurrent miscarriage, as Liam’s neurodivergent thinking pushed him to seek the absolute best to prevent further pain and suffering.
Liam shares that they eventually went through IVF in Sydney, flying over for the treatment.
Initially, they faced a few unsuccessful attempts with IVF, which added to their challenges.
They were ultimately fortunate to welcome their miracle rainbow baby, who is now two and a half years old and brings immense joy to their lives.
Around the time of their fertility journey, Liam decided to pursue a PhD in grief.
After the first and second miscarriages, he spent a lot of time researching grief and began his PhD, reflecting now that psychology as a special interest helped him cope, regulate, and make sense of everything.
Liam notes that understanding his individual differences really ignited his passion for this area of study, far more than before. It’s been an interesting and fascinating journey to explore through that lens.
Monique expresses gratitude to Liam for sharing his personal experiences of loss, especially around miscarriage and IVF, noting that it’s a common but rarely discussed topic.
She acknowledges the significance of both Liam and his wife being open to sharing their journey as a couple going through these challenges, highlighting how helpful it is for listeners to hear such personal stories.
Autistic individuals will likely deeply resonate with the need to thoroughly understand experiences, especially during challenging times.
Monique explains that for some, gathering every possible detail—whether through theoretical knowledge, studies, or reports—can provide a sense of predictability, helping to cushion the journey.
Processing information cognitively, particularly through an academic lens, can often help manage and process emotions, which is a way of coping that may spark special interests. Many listeners may relate to this approach.
“It’s interesting thinking about it from the lens of neurodivergence – in terms of how much I researched and became hyperfixated and passionate about recurrent miscarriage, which led us to finding experts and getting support that we needed, but also as well, it further magnified my interest in grief.
Around that time was when I actually ended up deciding to do a PhD in grief. I remember times as well, often after the first initial miscarriage and the second one, researching quite a lot about grief, actually enrolled in and starting my PhD. Thinking about it now as well, in terms of psychology being my special interests, I think that was a way for me to cope and actually regulate and make sense of everything that was going on in my life as well. ”
Connect with Liam Spicer:
You can find Liam through his website or on Instagram and LinkedIn.
Download Liam’s free client handout: EMDR & Grief PDF
Read Liam’s research paper: Eye Movement Desensitisation and Reprocessing (EMDR) therapy for prolonged grief: theory, research, and practice
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